A path to undo O which is constitutional being suggested...

[BaalChatzaf]

I anticipate that only a handful of those here would agree with this tactic. Most would be like the militia leaders who were in charge of men in towns around Charlestown when the Battle of Bunker Hill took place who did not make any effort to support those fighting the British with ammunition or men.

If the R's can do it to the D's then in a future election the D's can do it to the R's;. Do you want to see each election thrown into the House? What h happens if the Democrats get a majority in the House and a Republican wins both the electors AND the majority popular vote. Then the D's could undo it. Would you like that?

Such shananigins would lead to the destruction of the republic. And the last thing you want is another popular constitutional convention. God knows what would be foisted on the nation.

Ba'al Chatzaf

ruveyn

[GALTGULCH8]

Ba'al,

You and your "what ifs!"

The present fact that O is president could lead to the destruction of the republic! The barbarians are within the gate now. Now is the time for us to act to rid our country of this evil tyrant. You don't get the danger facing us right now.

[BaalChatzaf]

Ba'al,

You and your "what ifs!"

The present fact that O is president could lead to the destruction of the republic! The barbarians at within the gate now. Now is the time for us to act to rid our country of this evil tyrant. You don't get the danger facing us right now.

Then we shall have to have yet another Revolution (eventually). Right know most Americans are willing to go along with Obama, his buddies and the neo-fascist welfare state. You have a choice. Take up arms. Leave the country. Or put up with it.

Ba'al Chatzaf

[jts]

Ba'al,

You and your "what ifs!"

The present fact that O is president could lead to the destruction of the republic! The barbarians at within the gate now. Now is the time for us to act to rid our country of this evil tyrant. You don't get the danger facing us right now.

Then we shall have to have yet another Revolution (eventually). Right know most Americans are willing to go along with Obama, his buddies and the neo-fascist welfare state. You have a choice. Take up arms. Leave the country. Or put up with it.

Ba'al Chatzaf

Leaving the USA does not seem to be a good option. Mike Adams has some experience in other countries and he wrote an article saying that the USA (as bad as it is) is still the best place.

Taking up arms does not seem to be a good option. That is exactly what the government wants. It will be an excuse for martial law. Then all hell will break loose.

Seems to me USA is screwed. And they have no one to blame but themselves. Ron Paul explained it to them. Peter Schiff explained it to them. Ayn Rand a long time ago explained it to them. They refused to listen. Too bad. Now suffer.

It's bad not only for the USA but also for the world. If the USA falls to tyranny, what chance does the rest of the world have?

I hear China is moving toward freedom. Maybe because they experienced tyranny and know what it is. It would be a wonderful surprise if China in a few decades becomes the new USA, the new beacon of freedom.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Prc1952-2005gdp.gif

[BaalChatzaf]

I hear China is moving toward freedom. Maybe because they experienced tyranny and know what it is. It would be a wonderful surprise if China in a few decades becomes the new USA, the new beacon of freedom.

http://en.wikipedia....952-2005gdp.gif

The mainland Chinese leaders have no concept of a right and even if they did (unlikely) they scorn it and hold it in contempt.

Ba'al Chatzaf

[Selene]

In the middle of an eastern Chinese city's new main road, rising incongruously from a huge circle in the freshly laid pavement, is a five-story row house with ragged edges. This is the home of the duck farmer who said "no."

Luo Baogen and his wife are the lone holdouts from a neighborhood that was demolished to make way for the main thoroughfare heading to a newly built railway station on the outskirts of the city of Wenling in Zhejiang province.

Dramatic images of Luo's home have circulated widely online in China this week, becoming the latest symbol of resistance in the frequent standoffs between Chinese homeowners and local officials accused of offering too little compensation to vacate neighborhoods for major redevelopment projects.

http://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory/home-amid-chinese-highway-symbol-resistance-17791098#.UK_vCO9qCdl

[9thdoctor]

Can anyone think of another time in our history when it would have been called for?

Thinking about this a bit more I can see it being justified in 1876 and 1960 because of the fraud involved. No one's seriously claimed, yet, that the 2012 result involved fraud, certainly not on that kind of scale.

[BaalChatzaf]

Ba'al,

You and your "what ifs!"

The present fact that O is president could lead to the destruction of the republic! The barbarians are within the gate now. Now is the time for us to act to rid our country of this evil tyrant. You don't get the danger facing us right now.

The Barbarians have been inside the gates at least since the time of Woodrow Wilson, a racist neo-fascist. That s.o.b. nationalized the railroads and they were not returned to private management and operation until 1922.

Ba'al Chatzaf

[GALTGULCH8]

Victor Hugo and Ayn Rand and others no doubt have expressed the notion that it is ideas which move the world, specifically philosophy or ideology which is responsible for the direction in which any society heads.

The issue goes deeper than politics or economics rather it has to do with basic philosophic issues and premises in the realms of metaphysics, epistemology and ethics. Notice that such subjects are not presented objectively to students until college. By then most have been indoctrinated by their parents, the churches and the media as well as cultural osmosis. And by then most have succumbed to the indoctrination and have not been encouraged to question or wonder or doubt rather have been led to accept without question and certainly not led to think critically.

Although the "answer" and "antidote" are known in the form of Objectivism it will take some creative effort to enlighten the populace or the younger generations from now on.

[caroljane]

Perhaps the best thing that can happen to the people of the USA is another 4 years of Obama. They refused to listen to Ron Paul. They refused to see Obama as he is. They refused to listen to reason. They refused to listen to good economists and good philosophers. So maybe they need to hit bottom. You ask: what does "hit bottom" mean?

A man refuses to acknowledge that he has a problem with alcohol. It is obvious to everyone around him. One day he is lying in a ditch in his own vomit with empty whiskey bottles beside him. He drank away his money and his job and his health. His wife changed the lock on the door. At that point he has hit bottom. Now he starts doing something about his problem with alcohol.

Maybe that's what the USA needs to do, hit bottom.

Jerry:

This post of yours is correct.

Excellent argument and it looks like this will have to be the path.

A...

Come on, Adam!. You, a teacher of rhetoric, call this an "excellent argument". It is neither excellent nor argument. It might be part of an argument from analogy, the most untrustworthy type of argument you can bring. It's just a metaphor, a common trite one, routinely hauled out to shore up a bias.

[Selene]

Carol:

You need not be so absolute about a particular argument advanced by our Jerry...

It is one of his better ones.

It works on the underlying admission of personal guilt, which all of us possess, and, it capitalizes on the human desire of perfecting our faults.

It is a wonderfully powerful meme.

A...

[caroljane]

Sorry, standing my ground here. I admit it is one of our Jerry's better arguments, but that is not saying much. The "you gotta hit bottom to see the light" meme is powerful, sure, but it is a meme not an argument. It is a support to whatever argument you are making, basic essay/debate structure. If you can get your opponent, or reader, or jury to think about it and not about the A is A facts you are arguing about, you can carry away your opposition and win your case like Phryne and Roark.

[GALTGULCH8]

"The Barbarians have been inside the gates at least since the time of Woodrow Wilson, a racist neo-fascist. That s.o.b. nationalized the railroads and they were not returned to private management and operation until 1922.

Ba'al"

Perhaps worst of all, Woodrow Wilson signed into law the secretly created Federal Reserve Act of 1913, which I understand he came to regret when he came to his senses, having realized what he had done and is said to have said that by signing it "I have ruined my country!"

I just wonder how he brought himself to sign it in the first place if he had the understanding which led him to regret it.

The ignorance of the populace to this day, about such seemingly elusive and mysterious matters as the nature of the Federal Reserve System, which is kept over their heads all their lives by the powers that be, is astonishing.

The other baffling conundrum is whatever happened to cause Alan Greenspan, who once upon a time did comprehend the nature of the Federal Reserve, came to convincingly blurt out recently, "The U.S. can never default on its debt because we have a printing press and can always print up the money needed to pay the national debt."

How did he come to betray his own judgment on the issue of counterfeiting the currency?

What was ever told to him to cause him to go over to the statist mentality?

Ayn Rand was once comforted and hopeful to know that Greenspan was chosen to become the Chairman of the Federal Reserve. She must have turned over in her grave.

Given the degree of indoctrination of the younger generation what a challenge it is to deprogram entire generations if we are to restore our once free limited Constitutional Republic. I am not impressed that the making of the trilogy of Atlas Shrugged has caught the attention of the culture, certainly not to the degree that the vampire movies have.

[BaalChatzaf]

Given the degree of indoctrination of the younger generation what a challenge it is to deprogram entire generations if we are to restore our once free limited Constitutional Republic. I am not impressed that the making of the trilogy of Atlas Shrugged has caught the attention of the culture, certainly not to the degree that the vampire movies have.

There is only one way I can see for this to happen: the total collapse of the current system. And the consequence could be something even worse than we have now. If we ever had another Constitutional Convention I have doubts whether free speech/expression would survive a revision or replacement of the current constitution.

The sad fact is this: the pinko stinko Democrat commie loving statist neo-fascist liberals own the culture. They control the news, the schools and the entertainment industry.

Ba'al Chatzaf

Ba'al Chatzaf

[Jerry Biggers]

Carol:

You need not be so absolute about a particular argument advanced by our Jerry...

It is one of his better ones.

It works on the underlying admission of personal guilt, which all of us possess, and, it capitalizes on the human desire of perfecting our faults.

It is a wonderfully powerful meme.

A...

Although I am sure that references on OL, in this thread, to "our Jerry," are clear to all clear-thinking (e.g., those who have internalized ITOE? Just kidding,...I think) readers,

However, I am not as comfortable that regime apparatchniks - or their NSA/FBI/DIA/CIA electronic monitoring equivalents (such as the late, unlamented, CARNIVORE, or its current offspring), who are allegedly monitoring all electronic communications, [looking for anything that their paranoid mindsets, or algorthms, would interpret as a possible threat to a "Mr. Thompson" surrogate] can make the none-too-subtle distinction - that there are two or more OL members/contributors using the name, "Jerry" .... :blush:

and that this "Jerry" wishes to state for any statist recording device, and/or spooks, that: "I LOVE BIG BROTHER(s), " ( - they've done so much as role models for our wayward children), AND -

"MR. THOMPSON IS WONDERFUL" ( - including magnificent performances as a U.S. Senator and, of course, on "Law and Order."); . :rolleyes:

Now, call-off those damn Black Helicopters that keep flying over my house! :angry: :angry2: