Happy Independence Day!

[studiodekadent]

This is for all those on this forum who celebrate Independence Day.

I may be an Australian but yes, I celebrate Independence Day too.

So yes, Happy Independence Day! Drink up!

[BaalChatzaf]

This is for all those on this forum who celebrate Independence Day.

I may be an Australian but yes, I celebrate Independence Day too.

So yes, Happy Independence Day! Drink up!

The last time I was over in New York City I saw the Statue of Liberty standing in the harbor and I though how often nations build memorials to their dead.

Ba'al Chatzaf

[caroljane]

Thank you, America.

In our joint birthday week I thank you with all my heart, because if your country did not exist, neither would mine.

By the early 1860's most factors indicated that the north-south trade and cultural patterns would result in regional| mergers, with Atlantic Canada joining New England, and so on. (Alberta is still often called the 51st state btw, Adam).

But your Civil War (in which an estimated 40,00 Canadians fought) changed the map. The visionary MacDonald saw a viable possibility for a sea-to-sea political union, and exercised his political genius in forging a Confederation amongst a group of regional leaders who were only united by a mutual hatred and distrust. And the rest, as they say, is our history.

Canada was an unintended consequence, the good blown by the ill wind of your national tragedy.

Thank you for joining both world wars. My grandfather and father might not have survived in battles continuing without the American reinforcement, and previous support. My other grandfather was in fact in the American Army, so thanks for giving him his first steady job.

Thank you for the Original Two-Thirds.

Thank you for my American aunts and uncles and cousins. If they were all I knew about the USA it would be enough for me to know that yours is a great country.

I often comment unfavourably here on what I perceive as injustice or blindness or littleness in America the beautiful.

Never think that I protest out of dislike or envy or resentment towards the success of America, the shining ideal of |America.

Always know that whenever I hear your anthem, even when sung by the ponciest, most execrable of homie hockey game openers*, my heart swells and the tears rise, because that banner yet waves.

*that would be the Chicago guy who looks, and sings, like Michael Palin in a Python skit

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

To the greatest experiment in human living on earth.

Man can govern himself without kings and queens.

We all now benefit from the blood, sweat, tears and thinking of great men and women from the past, It's good to remember that.

Happy 4th of July indeed.

A happy, happy 4th of July.

Michael

[Peter]

I will be watching the fireworks in Ocean City Maryland from a screened in breeze way next to the water.

Happy 4th!

Peter

[caroljane]

To the greatest experiment in human living on earth.

Man can govern himself without kings and queens.

We all now benefit from the blood, sweat, tears and thinking of great men and women from the past, It's good to remember that.

Happy 4th of July indeed.

A happy, happy 4th of July.

Michael

Amen. And Michael can I ask a favour? Could you pull out my Thank You America post above and repost it as a standalone New Topic? That way more browsing Americans might be thanked year-round.

If it is not too hubristic to request.

[BaalChatzaf]

I was just thinking. Canada, our neighbor to the North is a country where people are by and large free to go about their business, are not constantly oppressed or hassled by their government and seem to be a happy people nowhere near the state of open rebellion as has happened in Syria and Egypt.

Now the Canadians got to where they are WITHOUT a revolution. In addition they got to where they are without a bloody Civil War (our C.W. killed 620,000 Americans or 2 percent of the population and maimed 1.5 million another 5 percent). In addition the Canadians did not to a near genocide on their aboriginal people. If the Canadians got that far -without- a revolution is it just possible that our revolution was not necessary? Think about it.

Ba'al Chatzaf

[caroljane]

I was just thinking. Canada, our neighbor to the North is a country where people are by and large free to go about their business, are not constantly oppressed or hassled by their government and seem to be a happy people nowhere near the state of open rebellion as has happened in Syria and Egypt.

Now the Canadians got to where they are WITHOUT a revolution. In addition they got to where they are without a bloody Civil War (our C.W. killed 620,000 Americans or 2 percent of the population and maimed 1.5 million another 5 percent). In addition the Canadians did not to a near genocide on their aboriginal people. If the Canadians got that far -without- a revolution is it just possible that our revolution was not necessary? Think about it.

Ba'al Chatzaf

About us being a happy people I think you are right. I have not looked it up but whenever they do one of those contentment-with-your-country surveys we usually come out near the top. Talking with people on Canada Day recently, it struck me again how lucky we feel, how grateful.. the pride is not about how glorious is our history but more about how we live together, day by day. The pride of the ordinary, I guess.

[BaalChatzaf]

I was just thinking. Canada, our neighbor to the North is a country where people are by and large free to go about their business, are not constantly oppressed or hassled by their government and seem to be a happy people nowhere near the state of open rebellion as has happened in Syria and Egypt.

Now the Canadians got to where they are WITHOUT a revolution. In addition they got to where they are without a bloody Civil War (our C.W. killed 620,000 Americans or 2 percent of the population and maimed 1.5 million another 5 percent). In addition the Canadians did not to a near genocide on their aboriginal people. If the Canadians got that far -without- a revolution is it just possible that our revolution was not necessary? Think about it.

Ba'al Chatzaf

About us being a happy people I think you are right. I have not looked it up but whenever they do one of those contentment-with-your-country surveys we usually come out near the top. Talking with people on Canada Day recently, it struck me again how lucky we feel, how grateful.. the pride is not about how glorious is our history but more about how we live together, day by day. The pride of the ordinary, I guess.

To use Bush-I's phraseology - Canada is the kinder, gentler America.

But to my point. Do you think the American revolution was necessary. Could our current state of being have been reached by the Commonwealth Route?

Ba'al Chatzaf

[caroljane]

Baal, very probably it could. It was an active, intellectual, wealthy minority which engineered the Revolution. Most of the population was neutral or Loyalist. If the revolution had failed there would now be a united British North America --with Quebec much as it is now.

[caroljane]

.side note, my Massachusetts ancestor died before the Revolution, and he died wealthy which is why we have records of him. His sons all appear to have been on the British side.

[Peter]

Ba'al Chatzaf wrote:

If the Canadians got that far -without- a revolution is it just possible that our revolution was not necessary?

end quote

I agree. But the time frame to liberty would have been longer. England and the whole British Empire became free in time. It would be interesting to see a side by side timeline comparing America’s freedom to Britain’s and then our re-march to statism in the 1900’s as compared to Britain’s.

Ba’al also mentions that the American Civil War was not necessary. With no Civil War when would the south have abolished slavery? I think around 1900 and certainly by now, but I think there would still be second class citizenship for blacks in the south. Ironically, everyone else might be freer today if the south had not openly rebelled. Would there have been a much more vocal opposition to Progressivism today, from the south?

Peter